Dana Perino
The “And the Good News Is…”
Interview
with Kam Williams
Primo Perino!
Dana Marie Perino was born in
Evanston, Wyoming on May 9, 1972, where she grew up herding cattle at
the crack of dawn on a cattle ranch. In college, she moonlighted as a
country music DJ while majoring in Mass Communications. And after
graduating from Colorado State University-Pueblo, she went on to earn
a Master’s in Public Affairs Reporting from the University of
Illinois at Springfield.
Dana made history as the first
Republican female to serve as White House Press Secretary. After
seven years in the George W. Bush administration, she was recruited
by the Fox News Network to co-host a new show, The Five, which has
become one of the most highly-rated programs on cable TV.
Christians in word and deed, Dana
and her husband, Peter, devote considerable time to philanthropy
causes, traveling to Africa on numerous occasions to volunteer with
charities ranging from Living Hope to Mercy Ships. The former is a
faith-based organization working with AIDS victims, while the latter
is a state-of-t
he-art floating hospital which sails down the Congo
River to bring free medical care to desperate people living is some
of the poorest countries in the world.
Here, she talks about her life and
career, including the time spent as President Bush’s official
spokesperson.
Kam Williams: Hi
Dana, thanks for the interview. How are you?
Dana
Perino:
I’m pretty good,
thank you.
KW: You
know, I feel like I already know you, from seeing you on The Five
everyday.
DP: That’s
one of the favorite things I hear a lot on the book tour. I think
that’s a huge compliment to The Five.
KW: Even
though I’m very liberal, I still enjoy the show, especially because
you and Greg Gutfeld aren’t predictable in terms of your political
stances.
DP: I
know what you mean. Bill Shine, an executive at Fox, once said, “Who
would’ve ever thought that it’d be Dana Perino always defending
the unions and the TSA?”
KW: Or
coming to the defense of Obama administration White House Press
Secretaries. What were your expectations, when you agreed to do The
Five?
DP: When
we first started, we didn’t think it was going to be a permanent
show, based on the way it was pitched to us. They said it was only
going to run for six weeks. I said okay, because I didn’t really
have anything to lose. And I didn’t want to have an act, since all
I know how to be is myself. The good news for me is that Fox has let
me be that person. It’s been great for me, actually.
KW: I
think the show has really humanized you and allowed you to blossom.
Most people probably had you pigeonholed very narrowly, after only
seeing you as the mouthpiece for the Bush administration.
DP: And
who knew the show was going to be so much fun?
KW: It
reminds me a lot of The McLaughlin Group.
DP: You’re
not alone in that. Gutfeld says our show’s like The McLaughlin
Group.
KW: I’m
going to be mixing in readers’ questions with my own.
DP: Oh,
good!
KW: Editor/Legist
Patricia Turnier asks: What is the primary message you want people to
take away from your book?
DP: That
you don’t have to have attended fancy prep schools growing up, or
gotten an Ivy League education, or have your life completely planned
and mapped out to enjoy a great deal of personal and professional
success.
KW: Patricia
also says: You became the second female at your former position at
the White House. She’d like to know what advice you have for women
trying to break the glass ceiling, given that there have been so few
females, historically, in such government positions as White House
Press Secretary, Attorney General and Supreme Court Justice. She’s
wondering if you think some obligatory measures should be taken
ensuring parity between the genders?
DP: I
don’t. I think I was the right Press Secretary at the right time. I
know that I was chosen because President Bush felt I was the best
person for the job. I’m also very encouraged by developments in
Washington, D.C., a place where women in government can advance even
more than in private corporations. If you look at the number of
females who have been chiefs of staff and undersecretaries under the
past two administrations, the chances of a woman succeeding there are
very good, and I think that corporate America is trying to catch up.
And that’s happening not just in terms of political positions, like
the one I held, but with the bureaucracy as well.
KW: Scott
McLellan, the White House Press Secretary who hired you, wrote a book
which was a scathing indictment of the Bush administration after he
resigned from the post. Did his memoir make your job even harder, and
how did that betrayal affect you emotionally?
DP: One
of my favorite passages in the book is where I recount the lesson in
forgiveness I was re-taught by President Bush.
KW: I
was astonished to read that President Bush had urged you to forgive
him.
DP: That’s
how President Bush lives his life. One of the reasons I wanted to
write the book was to explain what I saw: he was focused on his job
and he lived his faith. One way to succeed is to make sure you’re
forgiving of little things… even big things. Certainly, that was a
betrayal by Scott McLellan. And it made my job harder for about a
week. But, at that point, when the president heard that I was still
tied up in knots over it, he called me into the Oval Office at 6:40
in the morning and asked me to try to forgive Scott. That just took
the weight off of my shoulders. But what really helped me continue to
do my job well the most occurred later that day as I was leaving the
White House, when President Bush said, “By the way, I don’t think
you’d ever do this to me.” So, he was a good enough manager to
know that I was tied up in knots because I was concerned about his
press coverage, and about how I was going to deal with the briefing.
But then I was also worried about my special relationship with him,
and that the closeness and access I needed in order to do my job well
was going to be curtailed. So, what he was doing was taking the time
to assure me that that access was not going to be curtailed, and it
certainly wasn’t.
KW: What’s
your best memory of the late Tony Snow, your immediate predecessor as
White House Press Secretary?
DP: He
was a giant of a Press Secretary. One of the best pieces of advice I
ever received in my life was from him on his last day at the White
house. I was very nervous, because I’d be taking over the next day,
and he’d been so popular and so great at the job. I didn’t know
how I was going to measure up. He was 6’5” and I’m only 5’
tall. He made me stand up, and he put a hand on my shoulder, tilted
my chin up, and said, “You are better at this than you think you
are.” I sort of made light of it at that moment. But it did hit me,
after getting through two weeks of briefings and finding my rhythm. I
thought, “Oh, that’s what he meant. I don’t have to be like him
in order to be good at this job. I just have to be myself.”
That’s a theme that recurred
throughout my career in Washington, and was also true with Roger
Ailes at Fox News. I wasn’t really ready, but he gave me enough
time to come out of my shell.
KW: Speaking
of your height, how do you feel about the way Greg always teases you
about being tiny whenever he does the intro to the show?
DP: I
love it. One of my favorites was when he said, “She uses toothpicks
for ski poles.”
KW: Finally,
Patricia says: As an executive at Random House, what would you say
helps distinguish a great book from an unknown writer?
DP: I
think trust between the editor and the writer, and a belief in the
project. Word of mouth helps as well.
KW: What
inspired you to get involved with the Mercy Ships, and doing so much
volunteer work in Africa?
DP: Initially,
it was when President and Mrs. Bush launched the Presidential
Emergency Plan for AIDS relief. So, I knew of the program for a long
time, and I was familiar with the statistics, but I had never been to
Africa until I went with them in February of 2008. I was really
touched by the whole experience. I told my husband that I’d like to
go back to Africa for six months after leaving the White House. He
whittled that down a little and we went for six weeks. Volunteering
and advocating for poverty alleviation, maternal health and early
child development on a global scale are very important to me. Later,
when I learned about Mercy Ships, I decided I’d like to see it for
myself. And Peter, ever the trooper, came with me to the Congo. While
we were there, we shot a video that reached millions and millions of
people, letting them know about Mercy Ships. I was so proud of that.
KW: I
think a lot of people were very impressed by your doing that,
especially since so many Democrats are convinced that Republicans
only care about the rich?
DP: That’s
a shame! It surprises me that people might think that, because when
they publish the charitable donations each year you see that, across
the board, conservatives give more. The AIDS relief program was
started by President Bush, in part, because of encouragement from
Evangelical Christians who felt a moral obligation to save a
continent that was about to lose an entire generation of people. And
now, Bono starts his concerts by asking everyone in the audience to
thank President Bush for saving ten million lives.
KW: Documentary Filmmaker Kevin Williams says: It seems like the past several White House Press Secretaries since you left the job have been much more combative and antagonistic towards reporters asking tough questions. Do you think that’s the result of the recent jobholders’ nerves wearing thin or of a fundamental change in the role of the White House Press Secretary?
DP: I
would say that there was a great deal of tension as well between the
press and my two predecessors as well. But I don’t necessarily need
to comment on other people’s styles. I would just say that I didn’t
feel that it was very productive or helpful to the people of America
for the White House Press Secretary and the press to be at each
other’s throats everyday. That wasn’t how I wanted to live my
life. They had a job to do; and I knew it was an important one. And I
had a job to do, too. So, I tried to meet them halfway. I saw 50% of
my job as advocating and defending the United States of America
through the eyes of the Bush administration. I saw the other 50% of
my job was defending and advocating for the press so it could
maintain its access to the president. I don’t understand the
antagonism we see today, or why this administration has cut off some
access, like they did with photographers. President Obama is so
handsome, he never takes a bad picture. So, they didn’t need to
antagonize the press with that piece. In Chapter Six, I write about
how swallowing sarcasm and carrying yourself with dignity and grace
will make you more effective as a communicator than fighting all the
time.
KW: Kevin has a follow-up: Is it fair for people to see an unhealthy relationship between the political class and the press at the White House Correspondent's Dinner? Did you enjoy the so-called Nerd Prom?
DP: Hate's
a strong word, but I hate the Nerd Prom and I have not been back
since 2008. Big group events don’t suit me well. I’m not
impressed by meeting celebrities. And one of the things that
disappoints me about the dinner is that it is meant to celebrate the
young people who are being awarded scholarships. Yet, the guests
sitting at the tables won’t shut up long enough to allow the young
people to enjoy their moment to shine.
KW: Harriet
Pakula-Teweles asks: What would be the most important piece of advice
you’d give to an incoming Presidential Press Secretary?
DP: I
think I would pay forward the advice I got from Chief of Staff Andy
Card, o say a little prayer of thanks every morning before the Marine
opens the door to the West Wing for you, and it will set your day off
on a better foot.
KW: Children's
book author Irene Smalls asks: What is the toughest challenge you
faced at the White House?
DP: I'd
say the accumulation of stress and intensity, and the overwhelming
amount of work we had to do. If I got to go back and do it over
again, I would have taken better care of my health, because I really
let things spiral out of control, and I think I would've been a
better Press Secretary, if I'd focused on taking better care of
myself.
KW: As
Press Secretary your hair was short. Now it's long. Which is your
preference?
DP: I
had long hair for a long, long time prior to the White House. Now, I
have the benefit of professional help in getting ready to appear on
The Five. But I loooooove to wear a ponytail.
KW: Irene
also asks: What are your hopes for the country?
DP: That
we would recognize that we are so blessed to have been born here, and
that we are an exceptional nation with a great deal of responsibility
in the world which we need to take seriously. And that we need to
live our lives with joy, because that's what was intended. And that
we would come together and recognize that our problems are solvable.
We sometimes just lack the will to solve them.
KW: Is
there any question no one ever asks you, that you wish someone would?
DP: [Chuckles]
I'd just like to share my favorite piece advice from the book:
Choosing to be loved is not a career-limiting decision. My marriage
has helped me in my career more than perhaps anything else I could've
done, despite leaving an enviable career-track in Washington, DC when
we had nothing.
KW: What
was the last book you read?
DP: I'm
almost finished reading “All the Light We Cannot See,” which is a
novel about World War II.
I'm also reading “Munich Airport” by Greg Baxter.
Another book by him I loved was
“The Apartment.”
KW: What
is the last song you listened to?
DP:
Last night, I listened to the new soundtrack from the TV series
“Nashville,”
a show which is like a combination of “Dallas” and “Fame.”
[Laughs]
KW: What
is your favorite dish to cook?
DP: My
husband and I love steak with some sort of vegetables. But I'm also
very good at making a dish I call Blue Cheese Heaven, which is
stir-fried vegetables with blue cheese crumble melted served over
sourdough toast with horseradish spread.
KW: Who
is your favorite clothes designer?
DP: I
didn't really learn a lot about fashion growing up in Wyoming, so I'm
a little intimidated in Washington and New York at times. I'm lucky
that I found a young designer named Bradley Scott who takes such
great care of me. Whenever I have a special occasion, I pull out one
of his dresses.
KW: When
you look in the mirror what do you see?
DP: An
older version of myself. [Laughs] I have found a way to be joyously
content. I don't see myself as worried, or stressed or fearful
anymore, like I use to. I also used to see a very hard-edged person
when I worked in the White House, although that wasn't the kind of
Press Secretary President Bush wanted me to be. And it wasn't good
for my marriage either, so I tried to be the way I believe God
intended my life to be, which is a little more joyous.
KW: I
suppose that position forces you to be a little harder-edged.
DP: I
think it's very hard to leave those arguments in the Briefing Room.
But I was very much supported by President Bush and the White house.
KW: If
you could have one wish instantly granted, what would that be for?
DP: I
would like the feeling of serenity to be shared by more people in the
world.
KW: The
Ling-Ju Yen question: What is your earliest childhood memory?
DP: My
earliest,
childhood political memory was watching the inauguration of Ronald
Reagan. My earliest memory was riding a pony my grandfather bought me
named Sally at the ranch. I loved that pony.
KW: Would
you mind giving me a Dana Perino question I can ask everybody I
interview?
DP: Sure:
What keeps you up at night? President Bush used to ask that of other
world leaders because it would help him understand what their
anxieties were so he could work better with them.
KW: Excellent!
Thanks. The Melissa Harris-Perry question: How did your first big
heartbreak impact who you are as a person?
DP: I
remember very well when I was dumped in college by this guy I'd dated
for two and a half years. All of a sudden he failed to show up one
Friday night; and I never saw him again. I got the flu and was
feeling sorry for myself until my friend Andrea said, “We gotta get
you up and outta here.” And we started going to these country music
bars in Pueblo. We'd danced with every guy but go home with no one.
She and I are still such good friends. That experience taught me that
you can survive a broken heart.
KW: What
is the biggest difference between who you are at home and the person
we we see on TV?
DP: I
think I'm quieter at home. I need time to think, and I need time to
read which isn't an indulgence but part of my job, since I get a lot
of galleys
KW: The
Judyth Piazza question: What key quality do you believe all
successful people share?
DP: I
actually believe it is optimism, not the unrealistic, Pollyanna sort,
but the type that enables you to keep striving to achieve in the face
of adversity.
KW: The
Tavis Smiley question: How do you want to be remembered?
DP: As
kind.
KW: Finally,
what's in your wallet?
DP: Some
credit cards and an I.D. And you know what I carried around in my
wallet for five years? A scrap of paper with my sketch of an outline
for this book I wanted to write. For some reason, I never threw it
away, even after the first publisher I approached said the book would
never sell. When I showed it to the one who did end up publishing the
book, he said, “Leave this with me.” And he even wrote my
proposal, because he believed in it so much.
KW: Wow!
And it's been #1 on Amazon's best-seller list for several weeks
straight.
DP: Would
you believe it? Well, I loved talking with you, Kam.
KW: Same
here, Dana. It's been an honor. Like I said, I love you on the show
because you're not a predictable, hack Republican spouting the party
line, but a very sensitive and intelligent person who obviously
thinks for herself.
DP: Thank
you, Kam,
you made my day!
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